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General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: 2Heads on December 14, 2018, 03:01:42 PM

Title: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: 2Heads on December 14, 2018, 03:01:42 PM
Well, the EU has announced that Brits will not need a visa after Brexit but will have to apply for an ETIAS (European Travel Information and Authorization System) which will cost 7 euros, renewable every 3 years. Not too bad you may think BUT it will only be usable for a maximum period of 90 days in any 180 days - causing major problems for many of us.
Thanks again Bloody Brexiteers!
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: GeordieBorn on December 14, 2018, 03:49:07 PM
 A lot of water will pass under the bridge before that happens (and perhaps a few politicians) does not start until 2012 at earliest, we could be “out” and back “in” by then :D
 
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: levissima on December 14, 2018, 04:42:26 PM
2012? Do you mean 2021?

It’s the biggest mess imaginable and yet there are many still saying mount your unicorn and follow me to the sunlit uplands!
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: the wrong side of the valley on December 14, 2018, 06:31:57 PM
2012? Do you mean 2021?

I was putting it down to the copious amount mulled wine taken in an attempt to blot out brexit.  Its not working, either of them.
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: GeordieBorn on December 14, 2018, 07:38:10 PM
It might as well have been 2012 and in retrospect with the EU. Yuk mulled wine what a waste. 2021 it is, if it ever applies to us from the UK... ;)
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: old timer on December 14, 2018, 07:59:16 PM
It wont make any difference if we are in or our. It has nothing to do with the UK leaving it was talked about a number of year ago before we were looking at leaving. It is going to apply to all countries not in the schengen area.  Originally people were going to have to apply for a visa  but for a lot of countries it has been reduced to a ETIAS. It is the EU trying to flex its muscle. I would be more worried about how the Italian government is going with the EU. If the EU continue to be as stropy are they are I could see Italy wanting to leave.  You all must know how much the italians love the Euro.
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: IBarfoot on December 15, 2018, 12:20:57 PM
To be honest I am still not convinced the UK will actually leave. Funny I managed to travel and work in Europe before we joined the EU, it just took a little longer and required a little more effort but we still got there.
On another front first few flakes of snow this morning in Carunchio, still all is good, red wine to hand a beef in the slow cooker.😉
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: Venatore on December 15, 2018, 01:03:36 PM
There is much wrong with the EU and it’s policy’s. It does good too but it can be very academic in its strategy’s  and can lack empirical objectivity and nuance required for the greater good. I would cite the common fisheries and agricultural polices as examples.
I remember visiting Tuscany a few years ago and got in conversation with a local landowner. He had spotted me staring at his field which looked for all the world like a ploughed concrete car park being grey, compacted and short of organic matter. ‘Good land’ he says with a smile and not wishing to be rude I asked him what he was going to grow. ‘Sunflowers’ was the response which puzzled me further so I asked if this was good land for sunflowers to which he replied ‘ oh no, very bad, but the subsidy is very good’.
I believe the UK would be better off remaining in as it was rather than its partial or full exit. I also believe that the EU would be better off too having a counterpoint to its rather clumsy at times Franco/Germanic top heavy ness. Think what could have been achieved if the UK had put the same energy into reforming the EU as it had into leaving over the last two years?
I shall also end with a weather report as Prttorano had a good coating last night and the  pistes are open 🤗
V.
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: levissima on December 18, 2018, 04:10:42 PM
Worth keeping an eye on British in Italy

Here’s their latest

https://youtu.be/hXXwZLy5uKc
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: Venatore on December 18, 2018, 04:49:45 PM
Thanks Levi
The last line in the video sums it up nicely.
V.
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: the wrong side of the valley on December 18, 2018, 06:14:21 PM
Will all non UK residents in the UK then not get medical care?
The deeper you look the deeper it gets.  It used to be 'its just the depth that varies', but as the bottom is yet to be found ...
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: GeordieBorn on December 18, 2018, 10:36:58 PM
... don't worry yourself until it happens....
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: Relaxed on December 19, 2018, 10:29:26 PM
Hah! And you thought I was your resident project fear merchant.

Actually, I think she is incorrect in asserting that we will become illegal residents, certainly those of us who can prove continuous residence for five years. I had a long and involved discussion with a migration law specialist, who was arguing about the EU directive 2004 38 which talks about the concept of permanent residence (for which you can get a certificate from your comune if you qualify by length of residence). (He deals with this sort of stuff in the ECJ).
He was more optimistic than I was at the start, but he persuaded me that not only is the concept of permanent residence extended to third country family members of a union citizen (even after the death or divorce of the union citizen), but it is also entangled with the Vienna convention (which the UK signed, belatedly, this year). So his view was that anyone with permanent residence was at least 'legal'.

She's right on the health care and driving licence stuff, though (because of the permanent residence directive, and assuming that it does cover 'us') I think she is wrong on the car insurance front (assuming Italian insurance and Italian reg car).

So we'll see if it does come down to no deal. The crack on this is that May is deliberately painting the no deal armageddon scenario to frighten:
 1). the more moderate MPs to vote for her lousy deal
 2). the eye swivelling lunatic Rees Mogg fringe who want no deal, but can see that her deal is nearly Brexit, and the alternative is no Brexit
My bet is that she'll get 'her deal' through parliament, (but I'm in a minority of about one).

I despair of them all. They really have not understood that 'negotiating' with a ten foot high pile of legal texts simply was never going to work.
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: levissima on December 19, 2018, 10:53:51 PM
http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-18-6851_en.htm

While our PM is doing Panto in Parliament the grown ups have been busy.
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: Relaxed on December 20, 2018, 01:11:15 AM
Yes - and this is good news on the 'legal residency' status. (Of course, it post dates the comments of the barrister in the video, and should calm some of her biggest worries).

On 'visa free travel' I'm not so sure about the 'already adopted' proposal (it's a proposal - how is it already adopted!) for visa free status for UK nationals: if it means UK passport holders will only need an ETIAS (cheap and easy - but they'll take your fingerprints at the border!) than that's my current understanding, maybe this is a 'new' concession, but it's not clear.

Meanwhile, there's something quite amusing (which I haven't followed closely) about all these fridges which the health minister says he has ordered to cope with a no deal exit - if he hasn't paid for them before March 29 (and the funding isn't available until then), he's going to have to pay a truly yuge amount of 'import duty' on the freon type gases which are necessary to make them function ...

Does anybody truly think this madcap scheme is worth it? Please tell me if you do, I promise not to be rude!
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: Olive Oyl on December 20, 2018, 08:25:04 AM
While those people who have been resident for 5 years can be considered legally resident, those of us who fall short of the 5 year time period are scuppered. The whole thing is sheer madness - how could people not realise the utter chaos that such a decision would create???
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: Cesare Rinato on December 20, 2018, 11:14:41 AM
The most vociferous of those who are advocating that we leave the European Union are well aware of the disruption it will cause. Not just to your right to live in Europe, but also to trade, to flights, to national security, to haulage, to our access to medicines, to the market for our inshore fishing (that we haven't sold off ) to our imports of offshore fishing and imports of food and animal feed, to what remains of our manufacturing base, to our service industry, to our economy generally and to the value of the pound. Sadly all this outweighed by their need to minimise their tax exposure.

Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: Brush Strokes on December 20, 2018, 04:31:44 PM
Some good news for residents, hot off the press.

https://www.facebook.com/britishinitaly/videos/464863954283575/?fref=mentions&__xts__%5B0%5D=68.ARBZZVeuhvydY-0l1bnP3rq7urBYPzT3ZW-_ExTLxeK_9TNo94UM212HBAP8VGpTARDYDGnAUOmKEkKVcOfhwyJGWAPEbcP7DbOggdRgSbaf-4a8PqagxpbDnxYnNuHv0Oh20SaqGEPd4C3qeEHV3IBoiWwNTM_3wofuJiqgusF9Zic2qSK8B1Vwg2go9S7uGJLl4pOVRy-phJ84O3Y0R23bl-KUqSHJ4BY0EdYtExqesRbpFWUGpjtVqtxi4cx8lMnNICbSB08FgwIepl2KOjl89x6B-vTT1RzaqL79CIVIWf_joKAqFybRAw4TQzo_ViP3DtRpTyb8XclRpz_Wb_EQ-efrY84OWycIuhkZgmc16e5e3594aCWyhMw&__tn__=K-R
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: levissima on December 20, 2018, 08:31:40 PM
There is a Babbo Natale after all!

Here’s another link

https://youtu.be/mrEqwkPhGj4
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: Victor Meldrew on December 21, 2018, 04:48:59 PM
"Tears of joy and bottles of prosecco" as Brits living in Italy hear the news that their rights will be protected post-Brexit by the Italian government.
Brits living in Italy are celebrating after the Italian government gave them “the best possible Christmas present”, said campaigners from expat group British in Italy.

Italian government officials have confirmed that they are working on plans to secure the rights of the tens of thousands of British citizens living here after Brexit.

Deal or no deal, officials said Brits in Italy will not be waking up on March 30th 2019 as irregolari, with no right to live and work in their adopted home country; a possibility that has been fuelling anxiety among the country’s British residents ever since the referendum vote.

High-level officials from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs met with and confirmed to the committee of British in Italy that all British nationals legally resident in Italy on 29th March 2019 will continue to be legally resident and will keep their existing rights to work, the group stated in a press release this morning.

"We are absolutely delighted with this wonderful news for British citizens in Italy," Anne Parry of British in Italy told The Local Italy.

'"So many people have been so worried about what is going to happen on March 30th and now we can all relax and enjoy the Christmas break," she said.

"So many people have sent messages of thanks and support, often sharing their tears of joy and photos of bottles of Prosecco, so we are very relieved and happy today. "

"We feel we are truly welcome in Italy and part of the great European community.'
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: levissima on December 22, 2018, 09:23:48 AM
Nice to hear from you Victor, hope all is well🙂

This is really good news from the Italian Government, I hope the UK gets its act together in the New Year. Imagine a world without hearing the word Brexit, how lovely would that be?
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: GeordieBorn on December 22, 2018, 10:22:27 AM
Nice to hear from you Victor, hope all is well🙂

This is really good news from the Italian Government, I hope the UK gets its act together in the New Year. Imagine a world without hearing the word Brexit, how lovely would that be?
Sadly, no matter what outcome, that will never happen in my life time, the children's or thier children's lifetime. Apt this time of year - panto and letting the genie out of the box >:(
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: the wrong side of the valley on December 22, 2018, 10:56:43 AM
Except that a Genie will traditionally grant three wishes and I don't see that type of thing happening.
Is Italy going out alone on this agreement? I thought that every member was instructed to hold firm,holding hands so we couldn't break through on agreeing anything, discussing only with the whole...  UK - Italian trade agreement to be announced in New Year?  Freeish travel between the two great countries to be declared by Befana ?
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: GeordieBorn on December 22, 2018, 02:19:32 PM
Let’s make up 3 wishes each…
Wake up and it never happened !
Aliens arrive and stop it !!
Lock up all the politicians !!!
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: levissima on December 22, 2018, 04:39:07 PM
My three
1. David Cameron, instead of asking for confessions on immigration, just applied Eu laws. No need for a referendum.
2. Newspapers and the media only reported the truth and politicians were jailed if they lie.
3. I had a never ending supply of turnips for my herd of unicorns.
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: Relaxed on December 23, 2018, 01:05:40 AM
I think I'd only have one wish, and it would be that Boris Johnson had never been born.

I have a visceral hatred for the cynical self-centred calculation which this oaf computed. He had penned jokey rubbish pieces about bendy bananas before 2000 - knowing that he was making stuff up just to poke fun at the EU - but that could be forgiven as 'clickbait'.

He knew that Cameron was finished, and he wanted his job - that's all. As ex Mayor of London he knew that he was popularly perceived as 'the voice of the City' - and by extension the voice of 'business' (oh, what a joke - he ended up saying f*ck business when his selfish ambitions started to founder). But (IMO) Johnson 'reassured' doubtful leave voters that 'project fear' was just that.

I think Johnson was far more important than Farage as a 'persuader'. Farage we all knew was a long-time utterly convinced anti-european, what you saw was what you'd get. Farage (IMO) is not dishonest in his position - (we'll overlook election overspending for now, but it's notable that Farage isn't yet fingered in UK investigations).

The thing is, irrespective of illegalities in funding, and Facebook machinations, if the yellow haired one hadn't thrown his weight behind Brexit we wouldn't have it. He's an absolute b*stard - and it does seem that the Conservative MPs have recognised this.

Hunt is doing pretty well as Foreign Sec isn't he! My tip for the next Tory leader.

Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: GeordieBorn on December 23, 2018, 11:19:55 AM
Thing is at the time Boris “the buffoon” was an affable character secretly liked by many who would never say as much openly. I think it says it all (if true) where it states in Wiki that his earliest recorded ambition was to be “world king”. His true colours are now there for all to see and the “court jester” has become the “court assassin”. Despite this I think there are many in the UK that will never see him as anything other than “Mr nice guy”. If Trump can become president, then heaven forbid – PM Boris Johnson!
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: Venatore on December 23, 2018, 12:36:37 PM
‘Assassin in the court’ I like that!
I know it’s been appropriated by ‘Men In Black’ but maybe the title ‘Boris The Animal’ might  equally  be applied to this one!
V.
Title: Re: No Visa BUT.......
Post by: 2Heads on December 24, 2018, 03:57:19 PM
My favourite story concerning Boris.
His father looks very much like Boris and is an avid cyclist.
One day he was cycling up Whitehall when a voice from the pavement shouted "Boris, you're a total wanker!"
Without a moment's pause he shouted back "I think it's my son you're looking for"